Sunday, December 6, 2009

Gift Guides Bullshit

Always late to the party (again) - we’re starting to wonder if those Admins are asleep at their keyboards with the flurry of wacky, detached-from-reality posts from both marymary and HeyMichele dated December 2nd about how sellers can "nominate" your picks for the GG’s.

That’s right, sellers, another round of WHAT SELLERS CAN DO FOR FREE FOR ETSY while they twitter their paid-hours away on faves and more faves!

Once we get past the fact that all of this should have been a hot topic in mid-September, too late is really too late, and lame "announcements" telling sellers to do the work that ETSY REFUSES TO DO ITSELF is finally going over the edge.

Not only that, but both marymary and HeyMichele list several links that take awhile to read because, surprise surprise...there are RULES for nominating your GG picks!
1)Etsy stylized pix so you can’t see the actual product
2)You can pick your own items, but Etsy prefers you to work your ass of promoting OTHERS so you’re even less likely to sell
3)Make sure the item is sold in multiples, you know, like big box stores (fuck OOAK)

After you do all that reading, follow all the Etsy formula branding rules, never promote yourself, and buy into more and more Etsy asshattery, here’s the final message from HeyMichele:

"We can't promise all items nominated in this thread will make it into the guides, but we will be looking through them frequently. Additionally, we may select nominated items and place them in a different guide than suggested, or we may even select something different within the shop of the nominated item."

Total, complete and utterly arrogant BULLSHIT.


More work for sellers with absolutely NOTHING in return!

63 Comments:

Make Way for Deliciousness said...

I'm sure they're carefully going through all of the 680+ pages of that one nomination thread very carefully.

And seriously, their big push right now is for multiples of items? It's good to know that the work I put into each of my individual pieces is for nothing.

On the topic of advertising, I was reading a bridal magazine the other day and an Etsy member was plugged. However, the URL the article gave was just etsy.com instead of their shop URL, and with the search being the way it is who knows if people will be able to find them. I wonder how often that happens!

monkeybuttpowder said...

3)Make sure the item is sold in multiples, you know, like big box stores (fuck OOAK)

that rule grabbed me in the ass too. etsy your place for all things handmade. in bulk!

sick to hell over etsys refusal to act like a real company and hire a full scale marketing dept. tired as shit of seeing post ofter post encouraging sellers to tweet, twit, fiddle, spindle and fold posts onto every social networking site out there. nothing sells better than a site about tweens for tweens. love that penny arcade feeling!

you know, that 25.00 or less market is really profitable for self employed artists.

HOWDY said...

What a waste of time on both ends. Those women wasting all that time writing the article, all those forumers wasting their time hurriedly trying to kiss ass, and la de da de da.....

Bleahh said...

ps: took a VERY quick peek at that thread and it looks like more stuff under $20 and you are right-- not unique. Artists and craftspeople who are serious about what they do just don't involve themselves in those threads, I guess, but the newbies do.
You know what PT Barnum said.

The Funny One said...

Gift Guides on any retail site does attract shoppers, and those who need help picking out gifts do like using them --- but on Etsy, they're just a rubber stamp that closes the viscious circle of selective promotion. The FPT morphs into the FS while getting countless dorkies and Finds emails, then they get permanent slots in the GG's and the rotation starts all over again.

The Guides are another great retail tool that Etsy overcooked, and hasn't changed a bit in 4.5 years (only there are 72 of them, talk about punishing your shoppers!).

The incestuous promoting gimmicks are evident, but what really works for Etsy is that it's all built on propoganda that takes advantage of sellers while Etsy makes a huge profit for doing nothing at all. Etsy hasn't come up any new or interesting promotions in more than 3 years.

Design-wise, and technology-wise, it's one of the most boring ecommerce sites out there.

Even the big box retailers have made huge improvements in their online stores, but on Etsy, it's harder than ever to shop, and harder than ever not to be completely turned off by their overbearing biases that overpower every page on the site.

If it isn't impossible to shop, it's too icky to spend any time shopping on it.

trentongal said...

not only what you said but peeps can't even read the requirements for the multiples item GG!!!
if I can't sell even 1 of an item, why list more than 1... hello??????

Violets new Vintage said...

I held my breath and dove into the gift guides and saw loose powder in there! Who gives a person loose face powder make up for Christmas? Then there were all the picnic items on the front page complete with a huge wooden picnic table for sale. *shaking my head*

What is wrong with Daniellexo said...

Daniellexo on Twitter Sun 06 Dec 18:40

I wanted this shirt from @xenotees for soooo long! Thanks @"etsyseller" for getting it for me - you are a peach ;) http://bit.ly/4X2pUd

SK said...

This may be a wee bit off-topic...
I sell prints of my illustrations, and I don't mean this to belittle anyone particularly, but I know the price range of individual items in my shop is $5.00 to $20.00.

Anyway, I was kind of hoping to get in their "voter" thing. Except the one time I was actually home when the topic for next week's round was announced — it was the one for "high end" items. Which apparently meant something obscenely priced at $500.00+

I was a bit shocked to read that, but even more disheartened to read the line by Vanessa about how the items nominated for the voter are generally "first come first serve" — explicitly implying that etsy staff cannot be bothered to look through more than like 30 posts in their own f'ing blog post.

Like holy fuck, lazy much?

It's not "community" to tell me I can participate, but only if I've kissed the ass of 20 other people, because god forbid I try to promote MY OWN ITEMS — which is the entire point of going into business.

The fact that some crap that I've seen on the front page that was already an etsy staff pick favorite is exceptionally disheartening. It makes me want to smack some people.

geelizzie said...

The reason why they are asking for items with multiples is so that if one actually sells out of the gift guide, they don't have to do any additional work to find another item to fill it's slot. Seriously.

WHEW!!! said...

@"What's wrong with DanielleXO"

Oooohhhh! So THAT is how you do it?!? You BUY the admins gifties to curry favor wit them!

And here I was thinking I'd have to suck Rob Kalin's flacid little tube o' chapstick to get anywhere at Etsy! Thanks for the tip now I can throw away that sexual proposition email I was getting ready to send him!

ew said...

ah, bribery. lovely.

foxaz said...

Oh, the burden of being an Etsy fave... buying gifts for admin at the holidays must cot some $$- I wonder if it can be taken off your taxes as "promotion cost"?

I guess that wonderful warm feeling of giving is worth it.

Headshaker said...

I'm all for us leaving etsy en masse if there was a viable alternative site with actual traffic & buyers. I'm so sick of the etsy inequities, the bargain basement pressure & the beige hipster cowls. I'm looking for solutions & it's become obvious they aren't to be found on etsy.

FrickingBS said...

Has a study been done yet on the link between Etsy and Stockholm syndrome? I've seen no less than 5 admin tweeting today about their faves and bribes, yet haven't seen a single one in the forums answering important questions. And I am afraid to ask the real questions I want to in the forums, because I am afraid of being punished with no more features, ever. Not that I have been featured lately...

Merry Christmas.

NOT.

The Funny One said...

ah well, foxaz, I'm going to go ahead and estimate that the top 25 Etsy faves get a minimum of $10k worth of free advertising from Etsy every year, then add in the staff salaries for the Admins whose FT job is to promote them.

So, they can afford to bribe DXO and any other overbloated Etsy ego with one of their "multiples" priced $14 and under.

Bribing is an inadequate word for a bunch of employees who work for faves for free while plugging the company formula that makes it impossible for most sellers to sell. Even at 20 cents a pop, that still spells rip-off to me.

FantasyClay said...

What happen to one of a kind. but then to get seen on Etsy, most people make a listing for each item and then relist when it seems(of course renewing over and over) making people list multiples means people will pay extra to make an listing a multile where it wasn't before and also more when they renew. And Etsy won't have to worry about complaints like- why are items in gift guide still listed in they already sold, cuts down the maintaince they don't do anyway

FantasyClay said...

Headshaker
There is at least one good site, I went to Artfire in May when the SEO fiasco was being ignored totally by admin. Just getting found on google boosted my sales and now they have some real traffic.

eclipse said...

They are doing this Because when an item in the GG sells it is removed from the GG so admins have to keep filling that GG back up, which is apparently really HARD work even though they just refill those spots with the same favorite shops that are in all the other GG.

I think they want to feature items sold in multiples so that they don't have to keep restocking the gift guide. It's just laziness, nothing deeper.
As a side effect, the same item will stay in that gift guide forever if the seller keeps upping the quantity every time one sells.
This making that GG spot even more lucrative for the chosen sellers, and thus preventing new spots from opening up.

eclipse said...

What is wrong with Daniellexo said...

Daniellexo on Twitter Sun 06 Dec 18:40

I wanted this shirt from @xenotees for soooo long! Thanks @"etsyseller" for getting it for me - you are a peach ;) http://bit.ly/4X2pUd


--------------------------------

Awesome.
The etsy seller who bought Danielle that t-shirt is featured in two Gift Guides.

RRobin said...

Quoting Eclipse:

"Awesome.
"The etsy seller who bought Danielle that t-shirt is featured in two Gift Guides."

**

Business Ethics 101:

A company should avoid even the APPEARANCE of impropriety, such as accepting bribes, etc.:

http://www.globalethicsuniversity.com/business-ethics-issues.php

http://www.ethics.org/resource/conflicts-interest-balancing-appearances-intentions-and-values


As if we needed any proof that nobody at Etsy went to business school. Since they sure as hell didn't go to art school, where on Earth did they go? Perhaps they are not old enough to have gone to college at all: They sure act like a bunch of "tween" girls.

Awesome, indeed.

It's revolting.

And so should we.

horatia said...

eclipse said...

This making that GG spot even more lucrative for the chosen sellers, and thus preventing new spots from opening up.

--------------------------------

It might benefit featured people to have less total items in a certain guide, but spaces don't have to open up - I don't think the total items are limited in each section.

Degute said...

Does Danielle answer to ANYONE? Should her boss not be notified that this woman is clueless enough to accept what would look to anyone like a bribe, and stupid enough to twitter about it?
Do the same rules that apply to any job not apply at EtsyCorp?

The Funny One said...

I think eclipse is on to something.....and we have plenty of proof about Etsy shenanegins, but has it ever made any difference? This is a company that feels no shame, otherwise, why did all of them swallow branding as the right biz decision? Those promised options must be beyond multi-millions for each one of them.

AND if favoritism doesn't go far enough, who wants to bet the the Google Syndication beta stores were ALL FAVES?!?

Not only is this tool so late in the game it's no longer laughable, sean11 wants everyone to pat him on the back for more blatant favoritism towards only a tiny fraction of Etsy-brand-producing stores. Rolling it out to all sellers? uh oh, I smell a big pile of bullshit...........again!

How many more times are sellers going to let Etsy slap them around and do it so publicly? And so often?

No fees, no listing, no showcases and spread the word. And take all your customers with you to your new locations!!!

RRobin said...

Unethical and illegal are not the same thing.

It's not _illegal_, per se, for a company or its employees to accept bribes, unless that company is a nonprofit, a bonafide news organization (newspapers, networks), does business with the US government, or has an ethics clause in its company by-laws (which I doubt Etsy does).

Most companies, however, have an internal standard of ethics by which they abide. It is obvious that Etsy has none.

Fraud is, however, illegal, and there is a fine line between ethics violations such as bribery, and fraud.

Promising sellers a shot at the PF or GG by buying an Etsy listing, and then giving those spots to people based on bribery, probably is fraud, but I am not a lawyer or a judge. But...

Class action suit, anyone?

Living in the twilight zone said...

I think they want to feature items sold in multiples so that they don't have to keep restocking the gift guide. It's just laziness, nothing deeper.
As a side effect, the same item will stay in that gift guide forever if the seller keeps upping the quantity every time one sells.
-----------------------------------

By asking for nominations that only include listings in multiples, they've also guaranteed that thousands of sellers will scurry to add to their quantities, thus giving Etsy .20 for each new quantity added to a listing. I wonder how much money Etsy made by simply stating that they wanted items sold in multiples.

So, now we have all these naive etsy sellers with multiple listings and they won't even be able to sell 1.

lazy said...

that statement Vanessa made about the gift guides is true. UGH. SO LAZY.

the new voter is up "Gifts for her" so I went back & Checked out the submission post. Yep. I stopped at the first 10 who submitted items, who are in the voter.

Nice to know how it works/sarcasm

Enough said...

Another reason fucktard admins want "us" to find GG items for them...the search is so bad, they can't wade thru to find the beloved beige fingerless gloves with ironic mustache. It takes a lot of work bypassing the stunning art, beautiful ooak handmade items in bright colors & mastercraftswomanship.

The Funny One said...

Maybe we should start a list, anonymous of course, of Etsy sellers who left or are leaving in the next 30 days and put up an open (ongoing) board for them to detail the reasons why they left.

We know Etsy doesn't give a shit but I sure would like to know what other sellers think, especially after what Etsy did to the site in 2009.

If you're holding your breath expecting to make sales between now an 12/17 on Etsy, you might be better off setting up that other store on that other site.

If you aren't being promoted by Etsy, you no longer sell on Etsy.

And that includes most of us.

eclipse said...

Business Ethics 101:

A company should avoid even the APPEARANCE of impropriety, such as accepting bribes, etc.:
-----------------------------

I agree. I think this probably is not *real* bribery (or payment after the favors) because if it was, even Danielle wouldn't be dumb enough to tweet about it.
I hope.
But it just LOOKS sketchy and this is where Etsy is so clueless. They can't even comprehend why it's not a good idea to accept gifts from featured sellers and then tweet about it. (thus also giving another plug to the seller)
I just does not occur to them at all how that would look.
It reminds me of when a certain featured seller posted in the forums right after she was chosen, that she was offering all admins a large discount!
Can you spell CLUELESS?
The gift-giving could all be completely innocent, but by being so indiscreet, Danielle has now thrown suspicion on this seller.
Why not just thank her privately?

foxaz said...

this thread is a gem:
http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=6371923&page=1

People are selling Treasury spots now.

Is the snake eating its own tail?

The Funny One said...

DXO's lack of ethics isn't half as offensive as her inability to learn anything from her numerous past (public) mistakes, but the real problem is complete lack of supervision at Etsy and a group of Admins who believe they're immune from any criticism, no matter how bad (and public) their behavior and how potentially damaging their frequent posts all over the site are for the brand. If Etsy had ANY credibility, it's now below zero.

Their egos and thirst for popularity trumps everything else.

IF the selling treasury spots story is true, 2 thoughts come to mind:
1) sellers are desperate because they can no longer sell a damn thing on Etsy and
2) Etsy Admins have set the stage for unethical behavior, infantile rants, and other bad behavior including public spankings on the forums with the famous Lock & Mute routine.

Money makes people do some very strange things, and we all know who's making ALL the money on Etsy. Sooner than they know, it will all come crashing down on their little mustachiod heads.

Rtisan said...

I don't want Etsy to go down in flames or otherwise. I just want them to make the site more professional. That's all: easier for the buyers and easier for the sellers, without all the politics and numb-skullery.

I'm not stupid said...

I'm currently having a sale in my shop. 95% off anything for US customers but only if they are etsy ADMINs. I have been tweeting about it all day. Just kidding!

Happy Holidays to All said...

Hmmm, well the seller is listed in Brooklyn, so it COULD just be she knows her and wanted to give her a gift because she likes her and it is the season of giving. You are correct though that Danielle should never have said anything like that publicly or she should have left the sellers name out of it.

That is the problem though, they don't stop to think, its the same reason we get new features launched with bugs and then have to wait for them to be fixed.

CopcakesMakeMeGag said...

The Funny One said...

IF the selling treasury spots story is true, 2 thoughts come to mind:
1) sellers are desperate because they can no longer sell a damn thing on Etsy and
2) Etsy Admins have set the stage for unethical behavior, infantile rants, and other bad behavior including public spankings on the forums with the famous Lock & Mute routine.

**

Bingo.

Etsy admin set the standards and the ethics bar so low it is dragging in the mud.

If you can't beat 'em, join 'em.

CupcakesMakeMeGag said...

PS: I don't think Etsy sellers selling treasury spots is any worse than what Etsy admin does on a regular basis. Seems to me it's just a case of sellers finally getting wise to the game and learning how to play according to Etsy's own rules. If admin is upset, it is only because they've been out-Etsyed, and are probably wishing they'd thought of that themselves. Why is everyone acting so horrified? It's nothing new, and is probably more democratic than what Etsy iself does.

WTF said...

IF the selling treasury spots story is true, 2 thoughts come to mind:
1) sellers are desperate because they can no longer sell a damn thing on Etsy and
2) Etsy Admins have set the stage for unethical behavior, infantile rants, and other bad behavior including public spankings on the forums with the famous Lock & Mute routine.
________

It's been going on for quite a while:

http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=6081352

From last March.

And some of the people who admitted that they were approached with a bribe in March now in the most recent thread say "it must be a rumor".

WTF?

Big Surprise said...

Love this tweet: "What! Just heard no one claimed the free box of Etsy swag from Renegade Handmade in Chicago. (We tweeted about it last Sun)." Yay Chicago!!

Headshaker said...

I didn't become an independent artisan to have an etsy asshat set my priorities. From color to theme to quantities, these etsy admins, who know nothing about me, dare to dictate my time & artistic pov? I don't care what these asshats say is trendy. I'm not interested in impressing them or playing by their arbitrary rules. As it stands etsy is a venue for such a narrow trend based audience, it just isn't a viable platform anymore. The etsy employee general asshattery has erased all integrity that it may have had. I'm not here "for" etsy, and they sure as he'll aren't here for me.

eclipse said...

http://www.etsy.com/forums_thread.php?thread_id=6081352
this thread is a bit different though, it's about sellers approaching the curator and offering bribes to be featured, vs. curator approaching sellers soliciting a bribe.
But there was another older thread about curators soliciting payments, I just can't find it.

The Funny One said...

Sellers out-Etsying Etsy with bad biz behavior is a good one, but it only underlines the issue that, because Etsy has no quality standards, nor do they practice good biz ethics, that the site reflects this lack of attention to creating a viable, long-lived ecommerce platform. All those millions spent on branding experts will have been in vain once they tarnish the brand with more Regretsy-like sounding boards popping up to remind shoppers they should be very careful before they spend a dime on Etsy.

When legal challenges start piling up or they go on the auction block, maybe someone with real expertise will whip Etsy into shape and stop their self-destructive behavior. The bigger problem is that Etsy's unethical (and publicly so)behavior rubs off on every store, whether sellers like it or not.

None of these issues ever occur to Etsy, they're too busy laughing all the way to the bank.

Betsy Etc said...

Oh I could not resist. The fodder of Ridiculous and Moronic DanielleXO, tweeting about her gift/bribe proved too much to resist. I had to write something about it. I would love for a business publication to do an investigative report into Etsy ethics (or lack thereof) and expose them for the lucrative, yet poorly run clustrfuck that they are.

http://etcwtf.blogspot.com/2009/12/promotionalicious-goodness.html

The BBB is your friend said...

On a more serious note: Venting is all very well and fine, but if you have a genuine complaint please report it to the Better Business Bureau. I am here only to have a little fun and provide an outlet for my frustrations over the frequent BS I see, but the only way for real issues to be taken seriously is to report them to the correct agency. Please don't rely on this blog, Etsybitch, Regretsy or any of the other bloggers to "get the message through to Etsy. Maria, Rob, DanielleXO and all the rest don't take any of this seriously.

They WILL, however, take reports to the BBB seriously and if they don't, their apathy will be there for all the world to see.

You'll need their physical address, so here it is:
Etsy , Inc.
55 Washington Street, Suite 512
Brooklyn, NY 11201

Report your legitimate issues here:

http://www.bbb.org/new-york-city/business-reviews/internet-shopping/etsy-inc-in-brooklyn-ny-104233/

If everyone who had a genuine issue with Etsy reported to it the correct agency, then you can bet your butt that A- rating would plummet.

The Dangerous Mezzo said...

Etsy sucks.

And the Storque sucks extra hard.

I've nominated it for Most obnoxious blogger at the Blogger's Choice Awards. If you agree, why not vote? :)

http://bloggerschoiceawards.com/blogs/show/85584

The Sneaky One said...

BBB, you have a very interesting and valid point. Admin does read EB on a regular basis, but well, we can only do so much.

I would encourage everyone to do what BBB Suggested.. In fact, I am going to make your post a main feature, today.

Thank you! :D

Ella said...

I hate to just leave comments that say "I AGREE!!!!11!" but here I am : I AGREE.

You guys have and continue to say everything I have been thinking about these GGs and almost everything else about Etsy.

Please keep the flame lit under their asses.

Oh, I don't know if this has been discussed or not (I've been away with work(s) - I cant QYDJ!), but the url structure of Etsy's changed. Instead of YourShop.Etsy.com, it's Etsy.com/Shop/YourShop. It's all about Etsy, $eller$ are (almost) an afterthought. We are buying into the Etsy dream, which is why they are laughing all the way to the bank.

The Cranky One said...

name.etsy.com is stil valid, it just forewards to etsy.com/shop/name

Why?

Better SEO. I KNOW! Seems Mr Google likes "folders" better than "subdomains". It gets spidered better.

So this is an actual improvement on SEO from their big fancy SEO firm.

Ella said...

Okay, thanks for the update The Cranky One. A customer recently sent me an email saying that my shop links were wrong and I went through and changed all the links on my stand alone site, my blog and Fb. You're right, if this helps SEO, it's a good thing.

The Funny One said...

The SEO tagging and sequence still bothers me because it could be perceived as a "label" on your product listed on Etsy as:
1) an Etsy owned product
2) an Etsy branded product
3) is an "approved" Etsy branded product
that some shoppers may think ships from a warehouse in Brooklyn.

Which brings up the sticky issue of - who really is responsible for customer complaints about a product that carries the Etsy "brand" in every product title?

And if Etsy labels every listing as "Etsy" then why doesn't Etsy pay the seller for the product up front like every other branded retailer does?

If someone was doing some legal dissection, I wonder what the results might be?

Morrigan said...

Did anyone make a screencap of Daniellexo's Tweet?

Please someone say yes.

FUCKED said...

It's a free-for-all. Take a peek at the vintage showcase every day, and count the number of items that are mis-categorized as vintage. It averages 3-4 per day.

*The GGs are bought and sold, or chosen from other people's picks out of laziness.
*The "staff" knows very little to nothing about the items on the site.
*The CEO doesn't know what handmade is.

It's embarrassing to be affiliated with the joint, but until some place else gets me the customers I get on Etsy, I have no choice but to stay. It's like having a great house in a shitty neighborhood and not being able to sell it for what you paid.

And sometimes, it feels like a lot of the houses in the neighborhood are owned by a slumlord who rents them out to crack whores.

kyuuketsuki said...

@Morrigan: I didn't initially when she had her posts visible, but you can still search for tweets mentioning "Daniellxo" and it will still show up.

Lurker said...

Know how to get into the gift guides? Call out the duplicates with proof. The same day I wrote to them, I was in 4. first. time. ever.. odd, isn't it?

morgansilk said...

Not odd at all. All of a sudden I am EtsyGG popular. ....what I said before.......

eclipse said...

Morrigan said...
Did anyone make a screencap of Daniellexo's Tweet?
Please someone say yes.



------------------------
Yes. :)

Punkinhead said...

I was so naive to think "hey, they're asking for HOLIDAY ideas for the GGs, and I sell Snowfolk! PERFECT!" Not ONCE have my OOAK, repurposed, handmade, designed by me items been listed in a Gift Guide this season. I sell more at craft fairs and my local farmer's market than I have sold on Etsy in two years. And it's not because I don't promote my shop.

The Funny One said...

You are so right Punkinhead and I'd love to hear from longtime Etsy sellers who have sold hundreds/thousands of items UNTIL 2009 when Etsy went Branded and decided they didn't give a fuck about handmade, quality, or a fair price!

Many of us have direct comparisons with stores on other sites - and I can attest to the fact that I am selling very well OFF Etsy while not selling on Etsy at all.

The stores that sell on Etsy are promoted for free by Etsy 24/7 and for months, or more than a year relentlessly and because they list Etsy-branded products (without getting paid up front). In 2010, it will be ONLY those stores that sell, period.

Just remember that when you market your Etsy store, you are providing FREE advertising and FREE labor to Etsy, and when shoppers click on the site, they are bombarded with Etsy-approved picks. If you aren't one of them, think about sending a big fat bill to Etsy for "Services Rendered" and add in the cost of labor to your bottom line.

Move to another site(s) and take all your customers with you.

Eveline said...

The fact that I've had several people convo me to ask who it was, and then come out and say 'Oh yeah, DanielleXO, I had already guessed it was her' is so telling! Etsy should get rid of her, she's completely incompetent.

RustChic said...

in all honesty morgansilk,your work has never looked better and i think thats why you are in the gift guides. i dont always agree with your complaints but maybe bitching directed them to renew looking at your shop. whatever it takes.the stuff looks good.

Chantelle said...

I don't think Etsy cares about resellers/mistaggers or people who break the TOU.

I convoed Maria about DXO and the problems with the etsy-curated Gift Guides and Front Pages having items from resellers, mistaggers, or that otherwise break the TOU.

This is what I got back from Maria about the etsy-curated GG and FP:
"Regarding your statement about instances of resellers and mis-taggers featured in the Gift Guides and on admin-curated Front Pages, Etsy uses its best efforts, investing significant time and effort to review thousands of items and shops, to avoid featuring any such sellers in curated areas of the site.

Etsy does not jury sellers, and we enable sellers to tag their own items. As a result of both of these democratic approaches, unqualified sellers and/or improperly tagged items may periodically and inadvertently be featured. As you may know, we rely on Etsy users to help police the site, and we take great care to review all flagged items and shops. We make every effort to quickly remove any such items if they are indeed inappropriate. On balance, we believe that an open site policed by the community is more favorable for sellers than a juried site with strictly imposed categorization."

I'm shocked and appalled that Maria thinks it's ok to choose entries that don't match the TOU. Her reasons seem to be: etsy staff try really hard to get it right and have a lot to check; etsy sellers will catch the problems; and etsy isn't a juried site so they can't jury the selections.

That last statement about jurying is bizarre. Etsy is not a juried site. Etsy employees choose sellers and items to feature. How is this not putting sellers and items through a jurying process? And if the featured sellers and items are juried, why can't they also be checked to adhere to the YOU?

Clearly Etsy's "best efforts" at checking items aren't good enough. Trying really, really hard does not guarantee success, which is something that Maria doesn't seem to understand.

There's absolutely no reason for etsy admin to have to rely on sellers to check featured items for adherence to the TOU. That should be part of the jurying process, not something done haphazardly afterwards.

Etsy staff try, and they fail, but it's not a problem as far as Maria is concerned. I used to hope that Maria would be part of the solution to etsy's problems... but she's just made a bigger problem.

/end rant. Sorry it's so long.

Cook 'em all said...

Etsy does not jury sellers
=================

No, but they sure as hell jury that front page and the gift guides.

I've written to Maria before and gotten the same slipper non-answer. I'd faint if anyone ever wrote to that woman and she responded with "Thank you for letting me know about this. I can assure you I'll be checking up on it. This sort of thing is unacceptable."

Her oily rhetoric puts me to mind of Bill Clinton's misleading statements during the Monica Lewenski debacle.

morgan said...

It's not about me, it's about how they find their 'finds'. It doesn't seem to be a labor-intensive task was my point....and it should be IMHO.